Author Topic: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.  (Read 41675 times)

Nestea

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2006, 05:54:17 pm »
Even the IWAD downloads? Certainly some other program has a modified GetWAD to eliminate the chance of getting IWAD downloads.

Eh, who am I kidding... how is everybody doing lately?

AlexMax

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2006, 08:33:43 pm »
Apparently myself and a few other people have had their ZDaemon forum accounts disabled and their IP's blocked from ZDIRC.  I dont know about the other people, but I myself broke no Terms of Service while on their servers.  If they want undying devoution and lack of criticism of their port on sites outside their own, they should just come out and say it.  Preferably in big red text, right next to the "ZDAEMON IS FULL OF CHEATERS, TRUST NO ONE" signs they already have.

Nestea

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2006, 09:28:24 pm »
ZDIRC in general or #zdplayers?

leileilol

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Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #18 on: April 16, 2006, 10:06:05 pm »
Certainly some other program has a modified GetWAD to eliminate the chance of getting IWAD downloads.

Yeah, Codeimp had enough balls to prevent doom piracy in doom connector.
unidoom more like unifur
"Despite being a certified genius (166 IQ), " - fucking furry whos gullible enuf to fall for spambots

Nestea

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2006, 10:16:37 pm »
Ah. Thanks for the information.

TheDarkArchon

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2006, 03:59:06 pm »
Doesn't IDE and other programs using GetWAD do the same thing?

The last time I did, IDE did: I once had it pop up and idle pressed yes before cancelling it (It was post HD reformat: I forgot to move my IWADs do my ST directory)

excelblue

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #21 on: April 22, 2006, 11:43:32 pm »
It should be pointed out that ID's reply is just their opnion.

From what I see it, this is how is goes:
1.) Getwad is simply an utility that finds wads and downloads them - nothing more
2.) ZDaemon's ZLauncher makes use of GetWad to obtain any wad needed to play a game
3.) It is the user who attempts to download doom2.wad when s/he purposely tries to play on a server with doom2.wad

Considering that ZDaemon does not host a real version of doom2.wad, bans people for talking about or using a pirated version of Doom, and does not distribute it with their software - there's really no illegalness in this.

You can use any web browser, along with google or another search engine, to find illegal software. Does this make the browser software or search engine illegal?

While I do believe that something should be done about not searching for IWADs, it's mostly a morality and design issue here.

As for the person from ID saying that ZDaemon is violating the license in whole - nope, ZDaemon is not commercial at all - no donations, no cooperation to back it up: just a community of users. ZDaemon chooses the license in which ZDoom came from, which was the Doom Public License. Now, if this has anything to do with GetWad, it can be said that ZLauncher, etc. is actually a separate piece of software and is not subject to any of the licensing, as you can safely remove those parts and still have a completely working ZDaemon.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2006, 11:46:12 pm by excelblue »

Ralphis

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #22 on: April 23, 2006, 12:44:52 am »
It should be pointed out that ID's reply is just their opnion.

From what I see it, this is how is goes:
1.) Getwad is simply an utility that finds wads and downloads them - nothing more
2.) ZDaemon's ZLauncher makes use of GetWad to obtain any wad needed to play a game
3.) It is the user who attempts to download doom2.wad when s/he purposely tries to play on a server with doom2.wad

Considering that ZDaemon does not host a real version of doom2.wad, bans people for talking about or using a pirated version of Doom, and does not distribute it with their software - there's really no illegalness in this.

You can use any web browser, along with google or another search engine, to find illegal software. Does this make the browser software or search engine illegal?

While I do believe that something should be done about not searching for IWADs, it's mostly a morality and design issue here.

As for the person from ID saying that ZDaemon is violating the license in whole - nope, ZDaemon is not commercial at all - no donations, no cooperation to back it up: just a community of users. ZDaemon chooses the license in which ZDoom came from, which was the Doom Public License. Now, if this has anything to do with GetWad, it can be said that ZLauncher, etc. is actually a separate piece of software and is not subject to any of the licensing, as you can safely remove those parts and still have a completely working ZDaemon.

Awesome, in that case how about you remove zlauncher and getwad from distribution with the zdaemon package?

Russell

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #23 on: April 23, 2006, 08:10:09 am »
It should be pointed out that ID's reply is just their opnion.

From what I see it, this is how is goes:
1.) Getwad is simply an utility that finds wads and downloads them - nothing more
2.) ZDaemon's ZLauncher makes use of GetWad to obtain any wad needed to play a game
3.) It is the user who attempts to download doom2.wad when s/he purposely tries to play on a server with doom2.wad

Considering that ZDaemon does not host a real version of doom2.wad, bans people for talking about or using a pirated version of Doom, and does not distribute it with their software - there's really no illegalness in this.

You can use any web browser, along with google or another search engine, to find illegal software. Does this make the browser software or search engine illegal?

While I do believe that something should be done about not searching for IWADs, it's mostly a morality and design issue here.

As for the person from ID saying that ZDaemon is violating the license in whole - nope, ZDaemon is not commercial at all - no donations, no cooperation to back it up: just a community of users. ZDaemon chooses the license in which ZDoom came from, which was the Doom Public License. Now, if this has anything to do with GetWad, it can be said that ZLauncher, etc. is actually a separate piece of software and is not subject to any of the licensing, as you can safely remove those parts and still have a completely working ZDaemon.

It'd be nice to see the CEO from id software respond to what you just wrote, I'm sure he'd agree with you 101%

Oh yeah and if you didn't somehow sense the sarcasm in the above line, I'm sure he is happy to let piracy continue with the doom series aswell.

excelblue

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2006, 02:20:43 am »
Awesome, in that case how about you remove zlauncher and getwad from distribution with the zdaemon package?

It's packaged together, but there's still quite some separation. It's just like some BSD distros being packed with some GPL software, or some Linux distros sporting some non-opensource utilities. Packaging by itself does not make it all one piece - the zlauncher, zdirc, and getwad parts are all subject to a different license than that of zdaemon and zserv. That's because they aren't modifications of each other.

As for the stuff on getwad, I'll make it clearer:
1.) ZDaemon has no obligation to fix it... but
2.) It definitely needs to fix the problem

It can be understood that companies like iD would want piracy to be stopped, and ZDaemon supports that cause. It's just that most of the devs just don't want to spend the time adding some code to that part when time could be spent on something else.

Ralphis

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2006, 03:53:13 am »
Quit shitting yourself. This could be remedied so easily that it's not even a task at all. I can think of 2 solutions in about 3 seconds flat, ready?

1) Raider puts dud wads in his directory. GETWAD checks his servers first. Well, I guess GW downloading 0k IWADs would fix the problem immediately.
2) Kilgore puts a code in to not download doom2.wad, doom.wad, etc. This would take roughly 3 minutes.

Quit making excuses. ZDaemon is a firm supporter of piracy to further the growth of its playerbase.

Russell

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #26 on: April 24, 2006, 07:17:10 am »
It's packaged together, but there's still quite some separation. It's just like some BSD distros being packed with some GPL software, or some Linux distros sporting some non-opensource utilities. Packaging by itself does not make it all one piece - the zlauncher, zdirc, and getwad parts are all subject to a different license than that of zdaemon and zserv. That's because they aren't modifications of each other.

As for the stuff on getwad, I'll make it clearer:
1.) ZDaemon has no obligation to fix it... but
2.) It definitely needs to fix the problem

It can be understood that companies like iD would want piracy to be stopped, and ZDaemon supports that cause. It's just that most of the devs just don't want to spend the time adding some code to that part when time could be spent on something else.

Come on now excelblue, I know you are a firm believer of open source software, just like I am
It could years before the zdaemon dev's even decide to release the source (the real question is "if", rather than "when")

You have to realise that alot of the bad things that the zdaemon staff has done has had a really negative impact on the project itself, allowing piracy is one of them.
And it won't go away by waving a wand and pulling the wool over your own eyes and forgetting about it.

Surely, zdaemon has a growing playerbase and whatnot, but alot of dark clouds still shroud the project, and will continue to, until they are resolved.
Unfortunately, some negative things that have happened will always have a permanent mark on the zdaemon name, doom2pro releasing that trojan is one of them, sadly.

But yeah, I don't know what the situation is with zdaemon itself nowadays, I just hear tidbits of (negative) information that come through channels/websites occasionally.
It's been about 3 years since I was last involved officially with it (I think, might be around 2), I don't know (and to be honest, I don't really care anymore either).

Anyway, I wouldn't sit on these problems, I'd take action right now to remedy them, because if you (the zdaemon devs/staffers) actually do it, there would be less shit slinging
and more people playing and enjoying a game of doom, not to mention a much happier community and administration.

Neil

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #27 on: April 24, 2006, 01:50:04 pm »
From part 4 of the Doom source license, aka DOOMLIC.TXT

Quote
You agree to use your best efforts to see that any user of the Software licensed hereunder complies with this Agreement.

Turning a blind eye to the abuse of the id copyrights probably isn't sufficient here.

Infurnus

Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #28 on: April 30, 2006, 12:04:15 am »
Turning a blind eye to the abuse of the id copyrights probably isn't sufficient here.

That is very true.
Instead of evading subjects like these, the ZDaemon staff and dev team should face the facts and do their best to make things right.
what

excelblue

  • Guest
Re: ZDaemon illegally distributes Doom. ID Software responds.
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2006, 01:54:08 am »
Quit making excuses. ZDaemon is a firm supporter of piracy to further the growth of its playerbase.

How would you explain then, the removal of all players who are caught with an illegal copy of doom2.wad? Last I checked, when getwad accidently downloads doom2.wad (on my surprise), it's an unpatched version. Whenver a player has that problem, they usually ask most of the time. The first thing that always gets asked in where they got the doom2.wad. If they got it from GetWAD, they are always told that they should buy a legal copy of doom (and the hints on patching are not given out). Now, if they take the attitude of not buying and continue to use the warez "not caring", they are always removed from ZDaemon.

This is basically a passive thing that happens on accident. It's simply not right to be discriminating against certain wads in GetWad (thus disturbing the uniformity of the code). As for the duds - I cannot see how many people start accusing ZDaemon of hosting an illegal copy of doom2 or attack ZDaemon for "decieving" users. A real doom2.wad must be inside the zip or else getwad continues searching. Sure, freedoom can be dropped in there, but then there'd be some other problems. From what I see, Raider and Kilgore feel that the path of least resistance is to not care about the system but rather the users.